Ed. Note: Thanks to Eric Hufstedler for compiling this thread of email messages describing the MML's humble beginnings in 1992 as a group of friends exchanging emails with one another.
Date: Fri, 3 May 1996 10:12:40 -0500 (CDT)
Dan Harling says:
I was just talking to George Chang about an old thread when I realized that I have been on the MML for four years as of this past April 28th-- the day on which Gene Fusco saw one of my posts in the auto.* newsgroups and invited me to become the seventh member of the new list. The other members were: Jarvis Smallfield, Mark Willson, Shawn Clever, Jeff Brown, Wayne Johnson and Gene Fusco. (And if the three of you who still are on the list would care to enlighten me on the history of the MML before I signed on, I would love to hear it.)
Back then it was just a matter of getting everyone to add my address to their own mail aliases, until Jarvis set up an automated system a few weeks later. By mid-July we were up to 34 members; we had 56 in mid- September, and 70 by the beginning of 1993.
Before I go, I would appreciate it if Jarvis, Jeff and Gene would honorarily recognize my anniversary date as the 26th of April instead of the 28th: Hemi Day, 1992. Thanks guys.
Eric Huff says:
Yeah. How did the list get started? Did the originals know each other, or meet over e-mail? This kind of stuff should be passed on before the MML-Forefathers are all gone from the list.
Blasphemy! Leave the MML? You'll have to rip my cold dead hands from the keyboard. :-) And, BTW, MML-Forefathers can just as well describe everyone here.
Alright all, gather 'round and I'll spit out what I can remember. BTW, on that subject, I hereby nominate Dan Harling as keeper of the records!!!! Your numbers are much more specific than any I can remember (And I didn't bother to keep anything around to look up either). I'm not sure I would have come up with Mark's name either. Also, Gene will jump in and correct me if anything I say is too far from what really happened...this is all from memory folks.
It was a dark and stormy night. The wind howeled around the corner of the academic program's house with a lonely mornful sound reflecting the somber mood of it single inhabitant. Twisted with the pain that comes from a need unfullfilled, I had plugged myself into the ether in a forelorn search for MoPar. All around me was nothing save Hondas and Acuras and the ocassional Escort...if it was groceries I wanted, there were plenty of ways to get them, but I wanted FUN! Only the previous week, I had written a paper proclaiming the superiority of MoPar and submitted it to a math prof. here at Northwestern. He told me to talk to some of the literature faculty...but they only scorned me and laughed at me. Well, I vowed to get even, I would.... OOPS!!! Uh, wrong story folks, sorry. :-)
Well, I had read rec.autos for a bit and remember asking if anyone on there knew of a newsgroup or mailing list that catered more specifically to MoPars. A few of us got together kinda under the same questions and started communicating off-line. I don't remember if it was all 6 that Dan mentiones right away, I rather think it wasn't, but I know that talked to Gene for sure off-line. It wasn't very long after when we decided that we should all just be on each other's aliases and just make this easier. It's not much, Dan, but that's about all that happened before you came on. And that didn't even take very long...maybe this all started in March????
BTW, the first location of the MML as a "mailing list" (as opposed to just a bunch of aliases we each kept) was on casbah.acns.nwu.edu. I didn't know all that much about mailing lists (OK, I admit it, I knew nothing :-), but casbah was the most suitable machine amongst the group of us at the time. IT wasn't even a propper mailing list, but simply a system alias. Sometime late in that year (help me out here, Dan...Oct. Nov.???), I moved the list to thor.isp.nwu.edu because I had more control over that system and the list was big enough that people were being annoyed that any error messages were being sent back to the whole list. Thor was again a system alias, but someone had given me a script to help filter out some of the error messages...which worked alright. Unfortunatel (well actually fortunately) the list got so big that the thor's hardware couldn't keep up (thor didn't have nearly the memory or disk space casbah did, but most importantly, thor had this REALLY slow link to the outside world). Sooooo...the list moved off of thor and out of my keeping and moved to a much much better place where the list is a "real" list and the administrator does a competent job of managing the HUGE number of people we have on here now. As a point of reference, the number of MMLers was, if memory serves, a bit over 100 when the list left thor for greener pastures. I think that it's not far off of 3 times that many right now.
It's kinda a nice history. I remember that I thought it was cool when we got to 20 members on the list. :-) Kinda like the list was established then and not going away. :-)
BTW, the last 4 years on the MML (gosh, has it been that long, Dan????) represents the vast majority of my education on cars and MoPars specifically. I knew basic maintainance before that (and to swap out the ballast resistor if the '73 died :-), but not too much more. This is most definitely a cool list!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks to everyone on here for making it such...I would say thanks individually, but it would take too long to type that many names.
That's what I remember off this top of my head. There's many old stories that others know better (and even a few old wounds)...maybe this will make a good Friday thread after all.
CopCar George says:
I would suggest another category of MML facts... how many MMLers did David Wright invite into the group? He invited me. I was confused about the disappearance of the slant-6 from the Mopar lineup in the early '80s, and I was asking about it on rec.autos.technical. I didn't get too many replies, but David said that if I really wanted to learn about Mopars, I should subscribe to the MML. He was right.
84 Gran Fury (318/4bbl) 89 Diplomat (318/4bbl)
87 Diplomat (318/4bbl) 87 Crown Victoria (351W/2vv)
> Sometime late in that year (help me out here, Dan...Oct. Nov.???),
> I moved the list to thor.isp.nwu.edu...
Actually, we were on casbah for a little over a year; your notice of the address change went out just before Midnight on Jan 17, 1994.
> BTW, the last 4 years on the MML (gosh, has it been that long, Dan????)
'Fraid so, old man. It seems like the MML has been there since the Dawn of Time(tm), but then it also seems like just yesterday that it all began.
> ...represents the vast majority of my education on cars and MoPars
Same here. I learned a lot about basic maintenance from my Dad, and I was already headed down the Mopar road anyway--thanks in no small part to "Vanishing Point"--but the MML put me in touch with people who knew more than I did about how engines work, where to find parts, etc. I probably never would have considered building an engine if not for the intense education I received as a List member and the tremendous resource for parts, information and experienced advice that it represented.
Even though the list is so much bigger now, and each member's contrib- ution is a smaller fraction of its total knowledge base than in the early days, not much has changed about the MML and how (and why!) it works. I always have been proud of how smoothly the list operates in the absence of moderation, and how willing members are to offer patient explanations, advice and more, since these things are a reflection of the character of our members. Without that we would have nothing.
Daniel A. Harling
> Wayne Johnson and Gene Fusco. (And if the three of you who still are
> on the list would care to enlighten me on the history of the MML before
> I signed on, I would love to hear it.)
You remember more than me! Back then Gene and I shared an office (productive! ;) All I remember is coming back from lunch one day and Gene told me he signed me up on a mailing list ;-)
> Before I go, I would appreciate it if Jarvis, Jeff and Gene would
> honorarily recognize my anniversary date as the 26th of April instead
> of the 28th: Hemi Day, 1992. Thanks guys.
Have at it! I'd haveta dig out an old post or two to even remember the year ;-) I do have one from late July '92. There were 35 people then and I made a comment about how my R/T was "soon to be F6 green"... 4 years = soon!? ugh... Talk about wishful thinking ;-)
> > Sometime late in that year (help me out here, Dan...Oct. Nov.???),
> > I moved the list to thor.isp.nwu.edu...
> Actually, we were on casbah for a little over a year; your notice of
> the address change went out just before Midnight on Jan 17, 1994.
Ah, yes. We were on casbah for, essentially, but not quite) 2 years, then one year on thor (well, actually more like 9 months), and we're approaching our second year on chennov1. The easy way I try to remember this is that we didn't start doing the annual MML@ videos until our second year of existance, and we still had an MML@Casbah video.
As a point of trivia, when we were on casbah it was the only central NU mail machine (except for the ol' VAX) and ran off of SunOs. Since then, it moved to Solaris and then was replaced with an HP (of the same name) running HP-UX. It is now the oldest of 3 HP's that serves identical rolls. Probably doesn't mean much to you all, but being at NU, kinda meakes it seem like watching the world go by while the MML endures... as Dan pointed out, with the essence that makes this place great intact.
> > BTW, the last 4 years on the MML (gosh, has it been that long, Dan????)
> 'Fraid so, old man. It seems like the MML has been there since the
> Dawn of Time(tm), but then it also seems like just yesterday that it
> all began.
Re., the movie The Time Machine. Where the hero is sitting on his time machine and going through time while the scenes are changing aroung him. Buildings are going up and comming down. Ok, we haven't been around all that long, but the MML has endured alot...in internet terms anyway.
Congrats to all on here who have made it work (and taught me plenty :-).
> Actually, we were on casbah for a little over a year; your notice of
> the address change went out just before Midnight on Jan 17, 1994.
> works. I always have been proud of how smoothly the list operates in
> the absence of moderation, and how willing members are to offer patient
> explanations, advice and more, since these things are a reflection of
> the character of our members. Without that we would have nothing.
The above note puts me on the under 50 catagory (YEA!!!!!). And I echo Dan's sentiments, the MML is a model of internet useage at it's best. Truely everyone should be backpatted on this.
"Sniff" Kind of brings tears to my eyes ; )
Good job guys keep,up the good work
David brought me in too!!, Thanks David!
Scott R. Coy
Hey! I'm an older timer than I though I was!
I was sneaking a look at a newsgroup somewhere (rec.auto.?????) and someone posted something with a smiley. I can't even remember the subject, though I'm sure it was MoPar. But, anyway, this guy, goes on to say something like "as a member of the MoPar Mailing List (administrating it actually ;-) ...."
My thought was "allright!"
so I fired a note off to jarvis
subscrime mopar Andre Roy
Oh, and if you're not a computer, could you please arrange to subscribe me to the Mopar Mailing List?
Not long afterwards, I started getting mail from people with names like Hemi, Aquaman and Lizardman. What the heck did I get myself into?
I think I'm one of, if not _the_ first, Canadian on the list :)
I lurked for a while. 440 Dusters. Quarter mile times. Then....
Was it Hemi? I can't remember. But, there was a problem with a FWD.
A 2.2. One I had! I posted. I intro'd myself.
" All I have is a lowly 87 Plymouth Sundance..."
One of the Eds promptly e-mails me back
HEY! watch it.
In is .sig is an 87 Shadow.
You know, I still hold it's a "lowly 87 Sundance". But I'm comparing it to things like GTX's, Chargers and Hemi 'Cudas. ;)
I've been here for a while now. What is it? Three Christmasses now?
I was here for the Great Crash. The MML had grown, and it crashed Casbah. The MML had to go. Somewhere else.
That was on a Friday. back then subscribing/unsubscribing was a manual affar. "Jarvis? Could you unsub me for a couple of weeks? I'm going on vacation."
So I went on vacation. I came back to 475 or so messages! WOW! 475! In two weeks. That's about two or three days' output now.
It seems that when I sent my message to Jarvis was about the exact same time that casbah blew a rod (er...disk actuator)
It's been a great few years. I'm not one of the oldest here (at least in terms of length of service) but I've felt I belong since about the beginning.
Anyone remember "The Green Goose"?
Andre, somewhere ....
> You remember more than me! Back then Gene and I shared an office (productive!
> ;) All I remember is coming back from lunch one day and Gene told me he
> signed me up on a mailing list ;-)
Heck, what are friends for? :^)
David Wright invited me on as well. I had several questions pertaining to my Challenger up on alt.autos.rod-n-custom when I got the call.
Steve and Ann Lacker:
>> I used to be a subscriber of this list back in early nineties. I was
>> working at the Superconducting Super Collider in Dallas, TX...
WOW!! I haven't heard anyone mention the SSC in years (and yes, I believe the part about "Government BS!")
I guess you dropped off shortly before I joined- I came online around 1992 or early 1993- the list was being operated off of "thor" at NWU at the time. Shortly thereafter, the sysadmins shut Jarvis down, and after frantically e-mailing each other for a few days, R/T Jeff saved the list, and we've been "Aggies" ever since!
I still love the MML and all the folks that have added their wisdom over the years, but I do miss the old days when posting to the MML was like having a conversation in the office- I'm sure I'll miss someone, but the most frequent posters I remember were Jarvis, Dan Harling, Jeff Brown, Gene "the snow slithered down like a pair of badly made nylons" Fusco (anyone have a copy of his MoPar detective story? I can't find mine, although I KNOW Its buried in a few hundred meg of old files at work), Daty, Hemi Jim (welcome back, big guy. When ya gonna come eat more BBQ?), Aquaman, Lizardman, Gale Turner, RRRRobert, Tailspin, 300 Bruce, the ubiquitous Ed Campbell, Dan Stern (variously called 'strident, pedantic, stilted, and ' but a genuinely nice guy!), Jungle George Kozak, Trevor Rogers, and others. Then shortly thereafter came Thunderstruck, Brian "just add NOS" Stroud, CopCar George, Julie 'ModCuda' Moore, Tina Burlew.....
Then of course we had "Carb Wars," "The Tony Incident," The OTHER Tony Incident", "Oil filter wars..." But we survived them all.
What a run this list has had! Hope I'm still reading it 10 years from now...
* The last car I'd want is one for "everyday people" *
* Make mine Mopar... *
* Steve Lacker Austin, Texas *
To UNSUBSCRIBE send mail to UNSUBSCRIBE@mopar.tamu.edu
^^^^^^^^^^^ who could do that after this history lesson?